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client surrender insurance use 50,000 to open a cd could she get a credit?

Tinabrookyln
Level 3

she had a outstanding balance of 31,915.54 from loan, and the remaining she use to open a certificate of deposit

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IRonMaN
Level 15

Nope


Slava Ukraini!

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14 Comments 14
IRonMaN
Level 15

Nope


Slava Ukraini!
Tinabrookyln
Level 3

thank you, what about the outstanding loan balance that was paid, should a 5498 be filed.

IRonMaN
Level 15

Trustees fill out 5498s when they are needed, not individuals.


Slava Ukraini!
qbteachmt
Level 15

Form 5498 is what a brokerage or financial institution fills in when the taxpayer puts new money into a retirement account (Trad IRA, SEP IRA, Roth IRA) or rolls/converts. Think of it as proof of a deposit.

You didn't explain what type of insurance policy this was. You didn't explain what sort of loan got paid off. And you didn't ask about a specific type of credit. Is there something specific you thought might apply?

A CD is a type of investment. That could have been purchased using money inside of an IRA or retirement account. Or, it is from funds on hand that simply are ordinary funds, such as from a job or from selling a car or something.

More details sure would be helpful.

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Tinabrookyln
Level 3

thank you, she close out her life insurance from her place of employment, it was a Roth IRA, and also took out a loan  for about $20,000. they paid the balance of loan which was about $31,000, taxable amount was around $43,000. she open a certificate of deposit in a bank the amount $50,000.

Tinabrookyln
Level 3

she did not received cash in her hand only about $10,000, so my question was, could she get credit for the deposit of the 50,000 beca use they are charging her $9000.00 in additional taxes.

Just-Lisa-Now-
Level 15
Level 15

Her life insurance through an employer was a ROTH IRA that had a loan against it?

I think you need to get some facts straightened out because this scenario doesnt make sense.


♪♫•*¨*•.¸¸♥Lisa♥¸¸.•*¨*•♫♪
qbteachmt
Level 15

"she did not received cash in her hand only about $10,000"

That isn't a taxable event. That's an end result. A taxable event is a taking or distribution of funds, directly or indirectly, that changes the nature of the funds. Example: sheltered 401(k) funds that are removed, not rolled over, and no longer sheltered. That change becomes a taxable event.

"so my question was, could she get credit for the deposit of the 50,000"

For the concept of a credit; either the money was already sheltered, and continued to be sheltered (rollover), which means there was already some sort of benefit (pre-tax deduction from payroll). You don't get another credit for an event; that would be a double-dip benefit. Or, it is no longer qualified, so any prior credit or benefit no longer carries forward. There would not be a new benefit, in other words. Nothing new has happened.

"beca use they are charging her $9000.00 in additional taxes."

It's not taxes. "They" meaning, the company in charge of the distribution, has a required withholding against taxes, when someone pulls their money out of a sheltered condition.

This math really does not work right:

"she close out her life insurance from her place of employment, it was a Roth IRA,"

Nope. A Roth IRA is outside of employer retirement plans and is personal. The employer might have had a Roth 401(k) provision. Life insurance is a product (policy). Someone pays for that coverage (employer or employee). If that is group life, it is term and doesn't carry value. Or, it was Whole Life, which is unusual through your employer. It would not typically be "in" a Roth, either. Money in a retirement plan can be invested. It might be invested in an annuity. Any "cashing out" of a policy inside of a retirement account is not by itself a reportable change. If you hold stocks and bonds and sell them and gain or lose, that is not reported from inside of a retirement account. The account won't report capital gain or loss. Anything from that account is income. The nature of the investment in the retirement plan account is not handled the same as outside (regular investment activities).

"and also took out a loan for about $20,000."

Is this a loan against whole life insurance, or against a 401(k), or what? Borrowed money from where?

"they paid the balance of loan which was about $31,000,"

By taking some of what would have been a distribution? That reduces money in her hand. That doesn't change the fact of the distribution or the amount. It would be the same as if she got all the money in her hand, then used that to pay off a loan. The loan repayment doesn't change how the funds were made available to make that payment. The funds being made available is where and when a taxable change happened.

"taxable amount was around $43,000. she open a certificate of deposit in a bank the amount $50,000."

Since you describe an amount higher when into the CD, and you still did not identify that the CD is the investment purchased from inside of a retirement account, it is assumed your taxpayer contributed to something that also had growth and/or earnings and/or employer match. That means your taxpayer's money would have been post-tax, and explains why an amount is not taxable, and the rest is taxable (because it was never taxed to begin with).

There is no tax credit for moving your own money around from place to place. There is only a consideration for when a change occurred. In this case, your taxpayer removed tax-deferred funds and did not roll it over, so it is fully taxable. She could have gone on a cruise, or put it into a CD, or just burned it. What she did not do is continue to shelter it by rolling it into an IRA of some sort, then buy a CD inside that account. And that would not be a new event, so there is no further credit. It would be a continuation of sheltering funds that were already sheltered, so there was no amount considered taxable.

That's the best I can understand what might have happened, based on some intertwined comments.

Hope that helps.

 

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Just-Lisa-Now-
Level 15
Level 15

The story is a trainwreck from here, no clue whats actually happened.


♪♫•*¨*•.¸¸♥Lisa♥¸¸.•*¨*•♫♪
jerjev58
Level 3

Hi Lisa, I was trying to find you. I know I am in good hands. You answer all questions. 

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jerjev58
Level 3

Lisa, I need help with 1065 where to enter the assets for this partnership I am doing. Plus, I am not new, you have helped me so many times, but I was just having difficult logging in.

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Just-Lisa-Now-
Level 15
Level 15

Front page of the 1065, scroll down to Line 15. 

Right underneath that line you'll see a QuickZoom button to the asset entry worksheets to enter your assets for the partnership.


♪♫•*¨*•.¸¸♥Lisa♥¸¸.•*¨*•♫♪
Tinabrookyln
Level 3

Yes it did, I knew the answer I just wanted to be sure.

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jerjev58
Level 3

Thank you very much.

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